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Old 06-06-2013, 11:04 PM   #121
drag0nf0rce
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Fact: threads become 1000% more butthurt when people start asking and answering their own questions xD
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Old 06-06-2013, 11:14 PM   #122
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Originally Posted by drag0nf0rce View Post
Fact: threads become 1000% more butthurt when people start asking and answering their own questions xD
Thanks for that incredibly insightful bit of input. Can't even begin to explain how helpful you've been in explaining why I'm "butthurt".
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Old 06-06-2013, 11:17 PM   #123
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Meh, just trying to lighten the mood. People get a little tad too defensive when it comes to defending your own teams :3.
I personally don't give a damn, true my own team doesn't use Crit. However if every ninja i used in a team suddenly got nerfed, i would simply change team. This is a game that takes time to play, so if you submitted time to play, congratz, your playing the game :3, Just take more time to create another team xD
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Old 06-06-2013, 11:34 PM   #124
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I guess thats where we disagree.. I don't think its realistic to continue to nerf teams is such a huge way after they have dedicated months, if not years into their teams, and expect them to just start over. When you've spent a year or more on a camp team, and someone comes along and says:

"Oh, by the way, we've decided that after 3 years of this being in the game, now that your team is getting strong, its too strong, so we are going to gut the entire dynamic of your team composition to make to equal with the least performing teams of equal level instead of fixing those broken craptastic teams. But don't worry, you can just restart with something else."

I guess then we can see what your reaction will be.
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Old 06-06-2013, 11:42 PM   #125
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Actually isn't that what nerf-ings about? Making things roughly equal but still different?
The fact that some teams dominate the game is why Nerf-ing is around. I'm not saying that Crit should be Number 1 on the list, but it should actually be on the list.

Also Nerf-ing Crit is alot easier that nerf-ing Imm. -Imm has already been added and hasn't really proven that effective. However what can we add to make Crit easier to nerf? -Crit just wouldn't work. And an extra defense in itself would be too overpowering xD
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Old 06-06-2013, 11:52 PM   #126
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Actually isn't that what nerf-ings about? Making things roughly equal but still different?
The fact that some teams dominate the game is why Nerf-ing is around. I'm not saying that Crit should be Number 1 on the list, but it should actually be on the list.

Also Nerf-ing Crit is alot easier that nerf-ing Imm. -Imm has already been added and hasn't really proven that effective. However what can we add to make Crit easier to nerf? -Crit just wouldn't work. And an extra defense in itself would be too overpowering xD
The point I've been trying to make is that there is no solid proof that crit needs to be nerfed at all. For years there has been nothing about all this talk and now in a matter of months, its a priority?

I'm still shocked that udon is even considering it without a seemingly good reason.

And what? -Imm hasnt been proven effective? If you say so.

Last edited by Waro; 06-06-2013 at 11:58 PM.
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Old 06-07-2013, 12:07 AM   #127
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Wel bad choice of words xD
-Imm IS effective, but not as effective as everyone had hoped especially with the Imm campers easily able to get their Imm over 100 and still be safe.

And Crit is very effective, i've seen several battles with it in with the ninja hitting anything between 300-350 then crit comes in and boosts it to over 700.
Just because it isn't at the level Imm is 'Yet' doens't mean it won't overtake it, which i think it will.
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Old 06-07-2013, 12:37 AM   #128
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Crits has a LONG way to go before Immunity can't completely destroy it. Even with seg's FNK having well over 100% crit dmg, I can beat his entire team with just 2 jounin (not even FNJ), and his team exp is nearly 2K above me.
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Old 06-07-2013, 12:50 AM   #129
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if say immunity will get 50-75 cap(since this thread is really getting out of hand without adding much), would a civil crit nerf/balance thread take place?
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Old 06-07-2013, 01:34 AM   #130
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Tai imm already nerfs crit so we don't need another thing to nerf it. There isn't enough -imm in this game to combat an imm team without picking the -imm summons which paints those teams in a corner. If you don't pick one of those summons, you get boned hard by the abundance of immunity.

I think there needs to be a reasonable starting point for diminishing returns that lead to a cap. that way those stat don't immediately become useless but I also think immunity is the bigger problem. For -imm you would just have to scale it the same way imm gets diminishing returns. CDs returns can't really be decided until imm has been figured out but i'm sure crit users will want the same potential as ls nin has. Even if they have to overstack a completely separate skill to get it.
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Old 06-07-2013, 02:01 AM   #131
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Originally Posted by kuuya03 View Post
if say immunity will get 50-75 cap(since this thread is really getting out of hand without adding much), would a civil crit nerf/balance thread take place?
I've said many times that if

1 Immunity is nerfed
2 Buffing ls nin camping is seriously considered
3 A good idea for nerfing crit while keeping it the team with highest potential dmg is found

Then I'd be behind a crit nerf although having spent lots of time on my team to build the strongest camper. To this date I've only seen solutions that'd cripple crit and immunity is "too hard" to nerf so apparently we won't even try? That is how it seems at least.
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Old 06-07-2013, 07:49 AM   #132
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The amount of -Imm Lw's have increased alot recently, due to many Custom LW's having it and most the new ones having some. To nerf Imm, it's not going to be with more -Imm
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Old 06-07-2013, 08:47 AM   #133
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Sure lots of the new LW have -imm.... and they all mostly suck. sacrifice 30 attack for -imm? No thanks. Put -imm on some actually decent LW instead of these silly -imm and nothing else decent, and the stat might actually mean something other than to those of us that were able to buy ourselves a custom LW
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Old 06-07-2013, 10:07 AM   #134
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Sword of Betrayal
Tarnhelm
Gae Dearg
Ryui Jingu Bang
Terriblade
Pharaoh Gouge
Otegine
Omega
Keyblade
Arachne Bow
Phoenix Blade
Deimos
The Darkness
Musashi
Lilith


All LW's in this list Decrease Enemy Imm in some way, Sword of Betrayal being the only one to lower a stat by a noticeable amount (that being Stamina)

I don't see your point Bloody, some of these are very good LWs
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Old 06-07-2013, 11:04 AM   #135
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Originally Posted by Bloodysky View Post
sacrifice 30 attack for -imm? No thanks.
Think about it again and tell me - are you sure about this? If your ninja has 1000 tai and LW gives -10tai immu that means roughly 100 tai or, in other words, 50 atk. There are LWs with -15 tai immu, or even -20 and that would give you respectively 75 and 100 atk.
Ofc it is irrelevant against camper with 120+ tai immu. :D
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Old 06-07-2013, 11:11 AM   #136
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Quote:
Originally Posted by drag0nf0rce View Post
The amount of -Imm Lw's have increased alot recently, due to many Custom LW's having it and most the new ones having some. To nerf Imm, it's not going to be with more -Imm
I think it is unfair to bring custom lws into the discussion as they are unavailable for the majority of the players. -immunity is powerful against certain teams but overall it was quite a bad fix tbh and it does not fix the problems of certain teams having huge troubles dealing with immunity. Crit team is one example since they are "capped" at -60 tai immunity due to the availiable lw slots and lws while immunity campers have no cap at all for their immunity. Hence crit can never win against immunity campers. If the current system is kept I will eventually be able to pwn Sparhawk with my crit team BUT i will instantly loose the kage position to one of the red fox nin-kame campers.

Imho if immunity won't be nerfed I think we should just give up on balancing all together and just play the game with its flaws.
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Old 06-07-2013, 11:33 AM   #137
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Originally Posted by Seglarkungen View Post
I think it is unfair to bring custom lws into the discussion as they are unavailable for the majority of the players. -immunity is powerful against certain teams but overall it was quite a bad fix tbh and it does not fix the problems of certain teams having huge troubles dealing with immunity. Crit team is one example since they are "capped" at -60 tai immunity due to the availiable lw slots and lws while immunity campers have no cap at all for their immunity. Hence crit can never win against immunity campers. If the current system is kept I will eventually be able to pwn Sparhawk with my crit team BUT i will instantly loose the kage position to one of the red fox nin-kame campers.

Imho if immunity won't be nerfed I think we should just give up on balancing all together and just play the game with its flaws.
Not really a realistic view. Even against 126 tai immunity, I am able to win every once in a while with -53 tai imm and and its not like its crawling with ninkame teams. Why not just leave things the way they are instead of spitting on people who has worked for years to get where they are?
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Old 06-07-2013, 11:44 AM   #138
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Even against 126 tai immunity, I am able to win every once in a while.....
Its lvl5 death
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Old 06-07-2013, 11:45 AM   #139
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Its lvl5 death
Nah I won without death5 a few times :P But its just tactics, its something I want to overcome without nerfing imm. But people seem to forget its a tactics game.

Last edited by Waro; 06-07-2013 at 11:48 AM.
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Old 06-07-2013, 11:48 AM   #140
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Nah I won without death5 a few times :P
ok fair enough.. i just checked 1 fight tbh

edit: ah i remember.. put pain in last spot and you will win more because of NIN
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